The Focus Advantage: A Serial Entrepreneur's Insights for Peak Performance

After founding seven companies and successfully exiting three, today’s guest on the Harvest Growth Podcast transformed his personal quest for better health into a fast-growing business in the tough supplements market. He is Jim Phillips, Founder and CEO of Graymatter Labs, whose well-loved flagship product, Bright Mind, combines nootropics, adaptogens and plant-based energy to enhance focus without the jitters or side effects of prescription stimulants.

In this powerful conversation, Jim shares insights from his extensive entrepreneurial experience and his new startup on launching a business, expanding customer base, accelerating growth and getting the most bang for your marketing dollars. Whether you're an entrepreneur looking to launch your product or someone interested in natural cognitive enhancement, tune in for valuable insights into business growth and mental performance.

In this episode of the Harvest Growth Podcast, we explore:

• How a personal crisis can lead to a complete business pivot and a renewed sense of purpose
• Key marketing strategies for breaking through in a crowded market
• The importance of listening to customer feedback
• Insights from launching and growing a direct-to-consumer brand

Learn about how Graymatter’s products can boost concentration, lower stress and reduce brain fog at www.trygraymatter.com. Discover why customers ranging from entrepreneurs to individuals with ADHD are experiencing breakthrough results with this innovative supplement.

To be a guest on our next podcast, contact us today!

Do you have a brand that you’d like to launch or grow? Do you want help from a partner that has successfully launched hundreds of brands totaling over $2 billion in revenues? Visit HarvestGrowth.com and set up a free consultation with us today!

Transcript

Jon LaClare [00:00:00]:
Can you imagine the learnings you would get from launching seven startups in different business categories, including a business that analyzed every e-comm website to see what strategies drove the highest growth? That's the background of today's guest and he shares these learnings with you in a way that you can apply to your business today. Welcome back to the show. I am really excited to have with us today Jim Phillips. Now he's the founder and CEO of Gray Matter Labs. They have a product called Bright Mind. Got a packet here and he's probably going to show one as well. It's a phenomenal product.

Jon LaClare [00:00:52]:
I'll let him talk about what it is, what it does, how it's beneficial. But I will tell you I am a user of this product and love it. It's fantastic. I, I typically drink like half of the bottle each day. I'll save this for tomorrow but just to get focus and energy throughout the day. There's really nothing like this. I've been using it for a while and love the product. Again, I'll let Jim go into the story a little bit of what it is, what it does.

Jon LaClare [00:01:16]:
So you better understand from him than from me. But yeah, heartfelt recommendation on this product and you can learn more about it at trygraymatter.com we'll put that in the show notes of course, but before we get too far into it, Jim, I want to welcome you to the show. 

Jim Phillis: Absolutely. 

Jon LaClare: So tell us about, I did a little bit of introduction but if you could tell us a little, little bit more about Bright Mind, your core product from Gray Matter Labs, what it is, what it does. And how'd you come up with the idea?

Jim Phillips [00:01:44]:
Yeah, so it's a drinkable ADHD supplement. It's a natural alternative to prescription stimulants and it's a combination of nootropics, adaptogens, plant based energy, a vitamin stack and you just mix it into water and you drink it and it really locks you into a flow state, gets you going for, for multiple hours and doesn't come with any jitters or side effects like prescription stimulants do. How we came up with it I've been an entrepreneur my entire career, about 17 years across seven companies and three of them have had exits across multiple different industries. I was a VC backed founder, really young at 26 and I had no idea what I was doing. And I realized that pretty quickly. And you know, like a lot of people I tried to compensate by drinking lots of coffees and taking Adderall and other prescription stimulants and you know, thinking that that would make me more productive. And it had the opposite effect. I got burnt out, got a lot of anxiety and, and wasn't as, as good as I could be as an operator and as a founder.

Jim Phillips [00:03:01]:
So I figured there had to be a different, a different way. So I started studying how to improve my cognition and performance naturally. And I did two things. I taught myself how to meditate after, you know, reading and learning about all the long term benefits of the physiology of your brain. And that type of impact that was really, really helpful to me. Still do it to this day. And then second I started reading about and learning about and experimenting with nootropics and adaptogens. And if you don't know what a nootropic is, it's basically a natural substance that improves your cognition.

Jim Phillips [00:03:37]:
There's multiple ways that, that it can do that and get multiple different substances and I can kind of talk about that for want to get into it. And adaptogen is again plant based and natural and really helps to monitor and regulate your stress levels, your cortisol. So I started taking these things personally and had a really, really great effect, really positive effect. And when I would talk about them with family members, with teammates, nobody knew what I was talking about. They had no idea what a nootropic was. And so at that point I realized there was an opportunity to help increase the awareness of these substances. And didn't do anything at the time but ultimately had this idea as my career progressed and now I've gotten into Gray Matter as a company and Bright Matter as a product. So I can tell you how that all happened.

Jim Phillips [00:04:25]:
There's a bit of a story of my career arc. So my previous company to Gray Matter is called charm charm IO. It is a direct to consumer database. So it tracks every direct to consumer e commerce brand in the world. Think Shopify stores, WooCommerce stores. And what made it valuable is that you know your traditional business databases, like a zoom info, they have a very difficult time identifying just websites on the Internet. And that's what a lot of Shopify stores are. And the founder of Charm kind of realized that he was at Google, working on Google's commerce platform and Realized there's an opportunity to track DTC and got together a small team.

Jim Phillips [00:05:15]:
I led all of the go to market and you know, we were able to tell you every single brand in every single category and who the top ones were and what they were doing to grow. We ultimately ranked them on multiple different levels, how fast they were growing, how successful they were, how good they were at digital ads, if they were running wholesale, you know, it's this real deep breath of information about their e commerce store. And we would then sell that, that data to people who would want it, think anyone in the e commerce ecosystem that would want to use it as a prospecting tool or agencies or investors or even the brands themselves. So that gave me this kind of bird's eye view of e commerce and it, and it showed me where there might be some opportunities to launch a company and it made me interested in doing so. So I launched Gray Matter on the side while I was charm. And Charm was successful. As I said, we built it up. We ultimately sold it to a e commerce aggregator in New York called Swiftline.

Jim Phillips [00:06:19]:
And I stayed on with Swiftline to run Charm. That was in 2022. I stayed on into 2023. There was a lot of very good things happening. There was so much more that we could do with the business. And I was doing Gray Matter on the side. Ultimately, I got sick. I had a infection in my heart in late 2023 and it took a while to figure out what was wrong with me.

Jim Phillips [00:06:45]:
But by the time we did, I needed to have open heart surgery to save my life. And it was this very existential thing and it took a long time and I had to take a leave from Charm. And ironically, when this was all happening, Gray Matter started taking off. We started getting a lot of feedback about the product and our subscriber base 7x in Q4 of last year. And people were just telling us just astonishing things about the impact it was having on their life, especially people with ADHD or people trying to prevent cognitive decline. And, you know, I was laying in the hospital bed trying to recover, getting these messages, and it just made me think, you know, what am I going to do with my second chance at life? Am I going to go back to what I was doing, or am I going to take this opportunity to try to go help as many more people as I can with Gray Matter as a company and Bright Mind as a product. And so at the beginning of this year, I decided to leave Charm and pursue Gray Matter full time. So that's how we've Gotten to today.

Jon LaClare [00:07:48]:
And just to clarify, we were talking about Q4 of 2023 and then kind of the beginning of 2024. By the time this airs, it may be 2025 or so. And as we talk about and you, our audience might be listening to this months in the future as well, but they find it on various platforms. What a fascinating story you've been through and I'm glad you came through the sickness like how hard I imagine that must be. But as you, I think worded it, an opportune time to learn and really take off in a different direction. You talked about this sort of second chance at life. What perspective? I guess what changed for you during these 72 days that you were out and know, getting surgery and recovering and kind of away from your day to day life, which so many of us feel very busy. And you know, it would, I can only imagine how that would change perspective by being, stepping away, being completely separate from it and coming back at something.

Jon LaClare [00:08:42]:
Right. So it may not be the same job or, or whatever. How did your perspective change? What did you learn during that time?

Jim Phillips [00:08:49]:
Yeah, you know, I thought I was going to die and my doctor said that I likely should have. And when that happens it, and you get through it to some point, you're not as scared to die and you have a lot more appetite for risk and you have a lot of perspective that your time here is finite and so that you have to go and do what you want to do now. And so it just gave me a lot of urgency to want to do something bigger and better and more impactful with my life. Not to say that what I had done wasn't good, but I just wasn't scared anymore. And I wanted to go and see what I could do with gray matter based on all the feedback we've been getting and try to help more people. And so I did take on a lot of risk. I didn't, I didn't make much money this year. You know, we're now getting profitable, but we weren't.

Jim Phillips [00:09:52]:
And I'm lucky to have the resources from my previous businesses to be able to do that, but it was a big risk. And, and so it, it just really gave me the urgency and perspective that, you know, your time can be up anytime and you gotta, you gotta do what you want to do now because you don't know when it's gonna be over. And a lot of, there's a lot of examples in my life, and I'm sure other people's too, where in the moment something feels Bad or it feels, you know, you fight being sick and don't like what you're going through or whatever it is. And when you look back on it, you can connect the dots backwards as to why it might have happened. And oftentimes the struggles are the best teachers. That's very true. People say it a lot. And so in some ways this put me on the right path.

Jim Phillips [00:10:42]:
It was really hard and it was something that I don't wish on anyone. But I have a lot more purpose in my life now because of it.

Jon LaClare [00:10:51]:
That's a great response. I think a great way, great perspective to have on that. And I think we can all learn from it and hopefully won't go through the same experience. It sounds horrific, right? Scary. But as you said, we all have hardships in our life that was yours or one of yours that you've gone through. We all have something that happens, right? May it may be health, it may be financial, whatever family related, whatever it might be. And I, I have seen in my own life, you know, 18 years now running this business where there are certainly ups and downs. And as you said, I, I learned more in those downs than the ups.

Jon LaClare [00:11:23]:
Right. So in the hard times of getting through whatever it might be in personal or business life, as you get through that, the more you do right, the more you've done it, you realize there is going to be a way out. Right. I don't know what it is and it can be stressful in the moment again, whether it's health or business or anything in our lives. But if we can have that perspective to look back and, and think, okay, what do I learn from this that can be so healthy? And it's, it's something that's, that's certainly helped me and I'm glad you made through, made it through and, and, and really bounce back and not just physically, but with great business success as well. I want to talk, dive back a little bit into our early part of our conversation. You talked about nootropics and adaptogens. Can you talk a little bit more about sort of the science what goes into this? Into Bright mind.

Jim Phillips [00:12:06]:
Yeah. Yeah. So bright mind is a combination of, of four different kind of groups of functional ingredients. The first one is nootropics. And again, it's natural substances that improve your cognition. So there are things that you know are already in your, your body, in your brain that you can give yourself more of. And for example, alpha GPC is one of those. It increases the amount of acetylcholine that is in your Brain acetylcholine is a neurotransmitter that helps kind your different parts of your brain talk to each other.

Jim Phillips [00:12:40]:
It helps your memory. There are things like Huperzine A Whoperzine A is actually from a high, sorry, Siberian moss and it also increases your acetylcholine. It increases it by prohibiting the breakdown of it. So you can take those two things and have just better function in your mind and have a better memory. There's phosphatidylserine, that's actually a fat layer around your brain cells and it, you can think of it kind of like a lubricant and it just helps your communication in terms of different kind of mental pathways within your mind. And we have nitrocygine which helps increase blood flow to your brain, which is obviously very important. So there's multiple different things and then the last one is L tyrosine. L tyrosine is very important, especially for adhd.

Jim Phillips [00:13:32]:
You can find it in lots of different food products, but again you can supplement directly with it and it increases your dopamine production. Dopamine production is very important for focus. What ADHD is from a scientific standpoint is an imbalance in your default mode network in your cast network of your brain. And that imbalance comes from a lack of dopamine. So if you supplement with it, it can really improve the negative side effects of people with ADHD that have that imbalance. So those substances really just increase the firepower in your mind. The second group of functional grains are adaptogens. These are usually plants or mushrooms or roots and they regulate your cortisol levels.

Jim Phillips [00:14:20]:
So that's the stress hormone. And if you have too much because you're working too hard or constantly stressed out, these types of substances can kind of bring you back to a basel and help you get into a flow state just to keep you going and have a big impact on your mood. There's a vitamin stack in it, so there's multiple B vitamins, vitamin C, vitamin D, plant based energy that comes from maca, guarana, green tea and matcha. And it is caffeinated from the green tea in the matcha and guarana. But there's a substance called L theanine in it. L theanine is a calming agent. It actually increases alpha brain waves in your mind and it combines very well with caffeine in that, you know, you still get that energetic uplift of caffeine but it's, it doesn't come with the jitters like it typically would with you know, lots of coffee or an energy drink or even that kind of feeling of prescription stimulants. So it's very smooth, calm energy.

Jim Phillips [00:15:21]:
And then lastly, there's a stack for your vision things called carotenoids. These are actually pigments that are in your eye, plant pigments, and they help filter out blue light. So it was kind of like the icing on the cake for the whole entire stack in that, you know, all of us are staring at screens all day. And, you know, to reduce the eye strain and kind of keep you going longer, we added in some. Some things for your vision. So it's this very comprehensive blend of all natural ingredients, and it really helps improve your focus and lock you into a flow state for. For a long period of time. And as you noticed, I said a lot of things.

Jim Phillips [00:15:59]:
And the opportunity that we spotted was to make something for your focus, for cognition that really worked and worked in a way that you could feel quickly. A lot of what's on the market now, you kind of have to wonder, is it working? It's very subtle. You don't really know. Say it takes a while. Bright mind works within 10 to 15 minutes for most people and again, keeps you going for a long period of time. So the feedback we've been getting is really good. And, you know, again, it's all natural with no side effects.

Jon LaClare [00:16:30]:
Yeah, and I'll second that. I mean, from personal experience, it is, you know, I think a lot of us have taken energy drinks or maybe you're a coffee drinker as a listener or whatever it might be. But there is that, for me, a jittery like, you know, it works well. I've always heard that caffeine is great for creativity. And, you know, our audience is a lot of entrepreneurs. And I think it's a kind of an in the nature of entrepreneurs to be a little bit, maybe undiagnosed ADHD or even, you know, maybe it's diagnosed as well. But it's like, you know, that inability to focus sometimes because your brain's always going in a hundred different directions. And I do find with gray.

Jon LaClare [00:17:02]:
With Bright mind from Gray matter, it's. It does help me focus. It's. And it is like it's. It's phenomenal how quick it can happen. As you said, it's, you know, it's minutes after drinking just a little bit and does stay with you. So it is something to try. I encourage our audience.

Jon LaClare [00:17:14]:
If you. If this sounds appealing, check it out at try gray matter.com and try for yourself. But it's from personal experience. It's been phenomenal. Talk about. Oh, go ahead. Absolutely. And very.

Jon LaClare [00:17:28]:
And it's very true. I want to talk about ADHD a little bit. So, you know, we would want to be careful not to make any medical claims here, of course, but I think it is one of those things where you don't have to have diagnosed ADHD to benefit from a product like Bright Mind. So can you speak to that a little bit, maybe? You know, who else can benefit if we maybe aren't diagnosed with adhd?

Jim Phillips [00:17:49]:
Yeah, absolutely. We have a wide range of cohorts of people that take it for various reasons. ADHD is obviously one of them. Another big one is to prevent cognitive decline. We have a more elderly cohort of people that are taking it for that. We have some people that take it before they work out, actually. We have people that take it that have had concussions. There's actually a head coach at Clemson that was in a really bad car accident that tried everything he could before finding Bright Mind and, you know, couldn't get back to feeling like himself until he found us and tried Bright Mind and messaged us and super grateful.

Jim Phillips [00:18:29]:
And, you know, since then we found that there's other people that are benefiting in that way and then just optimizers, biohackers, people that want something more than coffee, that don't want to take prescription stimulants, Entrepreneurs, like you said, there's a lot of entrepreneurs that, that take it because it is a little bit more than, than just coffee and caffeine. And, you know, it doesn't have any negative side effects. Like if you were to give yourself a, an amphetamine, which is, which is what these stimulants are.

Jon LaClare [00:18:58]:
Yeah, absolutely. So I want to shift gears a little bit and talk about the marketing. So this has been, as you mentioned, successfully growing. It's relatively a new business, a couple years old at this point, but it's, it's growing very well in a space that's not easy. Right. So supplements notoriously is a category. It's a hard place to, to start out in. Right.

Jon LaClare [00:19:19]:
So the great thing with supplements in general, they can be good margins for those of us are, you know, that might be listening, that are in the space and they understand a lot about supplements. There's a lot of positive things. You can get people on auto ship when it works. Right. So you get people, once they buy, they keep buying from you, etc. But getting the initial purchase, getting them to trust in a sea of thousands of available supplements in store, on Amazon, on websites that they're constantly bombarded, hearing about how do you break through the clutter. I guess maybe let's go rewind a little bit to in your early days. Now that you're growing, you've got a groundswell, you've got testimonials, got reviews, all that helps.

Jon LaClare [00:19:55]:
But in the early days, how did you get those initial sales?

Jim Phillips [00:19:59]:
Yeah, so our initial go to market strategy was to be very focused on a specific niche of people and that was actually gamers. And so we designed the packaging for it. The website looked a little bit different than it does now and we found that it didn't really resonate with them. And so we kind of missed the mark right when we went to market and it was a bit too sophisticated for gamers. What we found through reviews and just everyday people that started buying it is that ADHD was really, really big and they kept popping up in our, in our reviews. And like I just mentioned, there's other cohorts in addition to adhd, but people just tend to get it. Even if you don't self prescribe to having adhd, you kind of quickly understand what it is. So having that marketing angle really has, has helped us and it gets people interested and interested quickly.

Jim Phillips [00:20:57]:
The second part is having a really good product and there's 3x the amount of ingredients in the next closest competitor that is in bright mind that really helps make it work and work better than what's out there. And so it did take a little bit for the word of mouth to really spread about that. But that to me is the biggest thing that's been the driver of our success is the product. And obviously you asked about how to get those first customers. We put it out there and missed the mark on our initial icp found through our customers who really was taking it and who it resonates with and then just shifted our strategy on marketing and copy and running ads on meta to find more of those people.

Jon LaClare [00:21:52]:
So some of that, those are great learnings to listen, right? To listen to the customers. What are they buying it for? That sometimes surprises us if you know other than that. So that's a kind of a learning that you kind of can only get with when launching sometimes. What else I guess have you learned since you initially launched that you might do differently. So if you launch this business today from a strategic standpoint other than messaging and kind of maybe target market you've already talked about, is there anything else that stands out? Something you've learned that you might change?

Jim Phillips [00:22:22]:
Yeah, there's ad creative that you think is not going to work or ad creative that you think is going to work and you know, really you don't know. And a lot of times as long as it fits your brand, you got to put it out there and see and get the data back, you know, within your decision making process and, and then kind of iterate from there. So it's generating lots of creatives and generating lots of different creative angles, having a very scientific approach, approach about it, making sure that you have access to the data on how all that, all those creatives are performing, especially in meta and other ad platforms and then iterating quickly from there. It took us a very long time to get good at that. I didn't have any experience in digital advertising before doing this and one of the things I would say is that you should absolutely learn Meta and Facebook ads if you're going to do something like this. It is incredibly important to our success so far that I know what it looks like within the Meta ads manager and what to look for and the different metrics that are important and how to analyze them. And without that, you're putting yourself at a disadvantage at one of the main ways that you can acquire customers. So I'd say definitely learn that.

Jim Phillips [00:23:47]:
Even if you, you know, don't have any experience in it yet.

Jon LaClare [00:23:51]:
It's, you know, you've mentioned that a couple times on different questions. The importance of learning, right. So learning from customers, talking to you, if you missed the ADHD messaging or importance, you know, would it change potentially the trajectory of your business? Also learning from ads that are working. You know, we've been a creative house for many years, national TV and digital as well. And it's, it's, it's. So, you know, even after doing hundreds of product launches and you know, thousands or if not tens of thousands of marketing campaigns over the years, it's hard to predict exactly what's going to work. As you mentioned, there's a science behind it, there's the types of creatives to test, but sometimes we still get surprised. It's about getting variety out there and letting the buyer, the consumer really tell you what's going to work through their pocketbook, right through making those decisions.

Jon LaClare [00:24:38]:
And one area we see that quite a bit is in user generated content. Right. So there's a lot of different types of videos to do and I, I don't recommend anybody to only do one right, including UGC or User generated content. But it can be a very effective marketing creative or tool to use. And so many times, because you don't control them. Right. We send product out, they kind of say we give them direction on what to say. Some, you know, they'll change a little bit.

Jon LaClare [00:25:00]:
They'll be themselves. Right. Which is what you want because you want them to be real. And it's, it's funny, we'll start with maybe 10 for a client or whatever and, and a couple of them come back like, man, I don't, that one doesn't look right. Like it's again on brand. But it's like the quality looks low. Let's test it. And more often than not, it's the one that surprises you that you know, that works and takes off.

Jon LaClare [00:25:18]:
And like I never would have predicted that. It's about getting variety and you know, being real with your audience and finding the right way to do that is what we found.

Jim Phillips [00:25:25]:
Yeah, yeah, I have a good example of that. So I made a more like a heavy, heavy production founder story video talking about where the idea came from, having lots of B roll in. It got, got it professionally produced and it's, it's working okay. But what's working phenomenally is just me talking on a podcast. I Talk for like 30, 40 seconds about why the product's different and that's got over a hundred thousand views and within like a month. Right. And the other one's working good. But we spent all this time on that and you know, the, the one that we didn't spend a lot of time on is, is actually the one that's performing best.

Jim Phillips [00:26:06]:
So again, just an example of, of, you know, having lots of different creatives and seeing what works.

Jon LaClare [00:26:13]:
Yeah. And really being real. I think you mentioned podcasts. That's, you know, that's one of the reasons we're sitting down today is it's just, it can be great marketing content because you're being real. Right. You're telling your story in a long form content way in ways that we can dive into it as opposed to a 10 second, 15 second sound bite. People can really get to know you get to know the product, etc. It's a, it's a marketing platform that works because it's, it's fun stories to listen to, to hear about the behind the scenes of a product that may or may not resonate with, with each individual audience member, but it's going to touch the pull the heartstrings.

Jon LaClare [00:26:42]:
Right. For people that, that are the right ones within the target Market. Well, Jim, are there any, any resources that you would recommend to our audience that have been helpful for you and your business growth?

Jim Phillips [00:26:53]:
Yeah, there's a lot of information that's out there that, that's super helpful to me. You know, the way that I think about this is that there's an endless amount of content and experts and people who know how to do things and have done things before you. That is online and you can go get it, and most times get it for free. And what most people lack is not the information, but the desire to go do that. And so I would say if you have a passion or, you know, a project that you're working on, go learn from somebody who's done it before. And you could find them on YouTube or different, you know, podcasts like this one, you know, different online communities. So there's a bunch that are in E commerce that have been. Been great for me.

Jim Phillips [00:27:33]:
I can name those if that's helpful. But limited supply is a big one with Nick Sharma, Common Thread Collective with. I'm forgetting the guy's name, but there's a. There's a bunch of other ones in, like in Twitter. Right. And so you just got to kind of find your people that are. That are out there talking about. About what it is that you're doing.

Jim Phillips [00:27:50]:
You know, listening to this podcast has been super helpful for me in terms of a marketing standpoint. So I. It's all out there. You just got to have the desire to go get it. There's a few books that have been really helpful to me. The one that I talk about a lot that has a really kind of funny title is how to Win Friends and Influence People. That has framed my thinking to kind of constantly think about what the other person is thinking in their position and how they're perceiving what's happening and going on. Very helpful in sales, very helpful in advertising, just in communication in general.

Jim Phillips [00:28:25]:
And again, it's a goofy title because it's written about 100 years ago, but it's a great blueprint for communication. So I definitely recommend that one and give it to people who, who work with me.

Jon LaClare [00:28:36]:
I love that book. It's Dale Carnegie's, you know, master work from like, I don't remember the year, but like you said, 100 years ago, whatever. But the principles still apply today. It's an entertaining read. It's really short and it's. It's something I actually haven't. I share stories from that quite often with my kids, with, you know, a conversation with employees, etcetera. There's so many things you can learn from it, but it been a while since I've actually read.

Jon LaClare [00:28:56]:
I should go pick that up again. It's been a long time. So yeah, I'm glad you brought that up. Is there anything I didn't ask that you think could be helpful for our audience?

Jim Phillips [00:29:04]:
No, I think this is a great conversation and if you want to try Gray Matter, you can just go to trygraymatter.com it's T R Y G R A Y M A T T E R. A lot of people put an e sometimes instead of the a. But try graymatter.com it's all there for you and I'm happy to answer any questions. You can reach out to me on LinkedIn, Twitter. Our email is on the website as well, so if anyone has any questions on the product, if it's new to them, happy to give more information.

Jon LaClare [00:29:37]:
Well, thanks again Jim. I do encourage our audience. Check out his website, follow him elsewhere as well. As you can tell, Jim's a very sharp guy, can learn a lot from him, but such a great product too. So I do encourage you at least look at what he's done if it doesn't fit your lifestyle to buy the product. But you can check out some great content he's developed and a really nice site too and learn from some of what he's done over the years. Years. And I do want to say also to our audience, did you know you can meet with a member of our team absolutely free for a 30 minute strategy consultation? We've launched and grown hundreds of products since 2007.

Jon LaClare [00:30:10]:
Learn some of our strategies while growing OxiClean back in the Billy Mays days. We're here to help, so please go to harvestgrowth.com and set up a call if you'd like to discuss further. SA.